# Talk:Money Making Game

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--TheTyger 10:19 AM, 02 October 2008 (Eastern Standard Time) The problems listed on the page are ones that you can get around. The tripling method is the idea, but rather than adding an additional bet (i.e. 1000 to 3000), you can increase by less (1000 to 2100). This fixes the loss problem, without drastically shortening the rce to 100,000,000.

Also, when you reach a bet that would be greater than the max (or max you are willing to bet), you can repeat the last bet twice. While you will need to win both bets, you manage to effectively half your risk at each time. This method can take from the 1000 min. bet. It would be 1000(lose), then 2 separate 1000 bets (if win both, then start at beginning, if lose either, replace each with two... etc). This method can be much more tedious, but eventually, you will(read: should) come out on top.

--Locan mures 10:39 PM, 02 December 2005 (Mountain Standard Time) Does anyone know if having a ten-leaf clover in your inventory effects win/loss percentages? There is a rumor going around on the KoL forums about it.

• I've figured out that clovers can help modify the outcome of a bet that you take. I've taken a picture to have proof. I'm not sure how a clover exactly effects this area though. Greyhead 00:56, 3 December 2005 (Central Standard Time)
• I found I also won more frequently when I used a clover but it's still speculations.
I also have looked into the game and I've discovered the more you play the less likely you are to win. I won frequently when playing earlier on Tuesday but as time went on I began yto lose more and more until I lost about 12 consecutive bets (And as you can guess I'm dirt poor now)
SO this is something to maybe look into. ~Nate_Pyrokai
• That's just probability at work: everybody loses in the long run. I sympathize about your losses, though; I'm in the same boat. -- Old Ned 00:41, 9 December 2005 (Central Standard Time)

--Shlaan 10:34, 29 November 2005 (Central Standard Time) added the text that the minimum bet is 1000 meat. there is a text msg for it if you dont, perhaps that be nice to note here too. i dont have it. also i changed the 1% house take to 0.1 percent. since 20 out of 20000 is 0.1% and not 1 %. this confirms with my own tries of the betting system.

With the new change, I have no idea how to format the information, but I've recorded a couple different versions of the result text:

--Poochy 23:32, 28 November 2005 (Central Standard Time)

• I've deleted the results text since they're all on the main page now. -- Old Ned 00:41, 9 December 2005 (Central Standard Time)

Hey, ya win some, ya lose some. I made 7 mil, then lost 6 of that 7 mil. I'm still ahead. Also, I've won 19 bets in a row, and one accidental bet of 1.7 mil. My only strategy was to take the second bet in the series. Meh, works for me. --EPITAthx1 20:09, 29 November 2006 (CST)

In my experience the game lets you go on a (limited) winning streak and then gives you a bunch of losses in a row. I've also noticed that taking not making bets has gotten me more money lately of course that may just be random chance... --Kingrollo 14:48, 22 September 2007 (CDT)

## Hardcore Warning

If you are in hardcore the winnings get sent to Hagnks so you can not retrieve them even if you are betting from your own stash.

-Uzziah

• I think it needs to be noted that if you retract a bet while doing a Hardcore incarnation the money is sent to Hagnk's, even if you got it in that incarnation. I'm also reporting this as a bug. --Damuna 18:34, 23 September 2006 (CDT)

## A format approach

Two colum so you can see win and matching lose text.

Coin flip
With that, the game begins! "This is how this works," says the old man. "I'm going to flip this flat, shiny, round thing that I found in the sewer into the air and catch it. One side of this thing I found has a picture of a spooky shrunken head, and the other side has a rather disturbing picture of a pile of severed bugbear tails. When I flip it into the air, you call 'heads' or 'tails.' If you pick which side this shiny thing lands on correctly, you win. Otherwise, this other guy wins. Ready?"
Win Lose
The old man catches the coin, slaps it against the top of his hand, and slowly reveals to you...

"Congratultions," says the old man. "I'll call Godot up and have him deliver 1,998 Meat to your account immediately."

The old man catches the coin, slaps it against the top of his hand, and slowly reveals to you...

--Shagie 18:48, 29 November 2005 (Central Standard Time)

• Aren't each of the games basically equivalent to different adventures at the same location? While this is not a bad format (I especially like that you used the wiki markup to simplify the table), we already have a format for multiple adventures, so we'd probably want to make these games look as much like that format as we can. -- Old Ned 00:41, 9 December 2005 (Central Standard Time)

## Know when to stop

As with all gambling, one of the most important things to know is when to stop- I had 50000 increased to 200000 meat then reduced to 500 meat in a matter of (literally) minutes.--Mrlumpy 07:58, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

-Of course. I'm currently winning by about 200k, and I know that it can be down in a matter of minutes. I suggest putting something in the 'strategy' section saying that a decent strategy is to go for, I don't know, about 5 bets in, then stop if you lose them all. My current strategy- 1k->5k->15k->40k. If I ever lose the 40k, I'll just start over at 1k. This way, I still have enough to try to make up the losses if I so choose, and feel lucky enough. --Zaphodak42 14:17, 22 May 2007 (CDT)

## loss-limiting strategy

assuming you have a fair amount of meat to begin with, you can use the 'doubling' approach to limit your losses in the meat-making game. Each time you lose, double the amount of the loss on your next bet. Once you win, you will have made back all your previous losses minus 1% for the house's cut.

Example: bet and lose 1000 meat, next bet 2000 meat. Lose that, bet 4000 meat, lose that, bet 8000 meat, etc. until you win. Probablity tells us that it is exponentially unlikely that anyone will continue to lose (or win) multiple times in a row.

I think.

• Actually, it works up until the 11th bet. With the house taking a 0.1% cut, you are looking at something like this:
RoundBetPossible WinMeat spent so farEarningsProbability (%)
11,0001,9991,00099950
22,0003,9983,00099825
34,0007,9967,00099612.5
48,00015,99215,0009926.25
516,00031,98431,0009843.125
632,00063,96863,0009681.5625
764,000127,936127,0009360.78125
8128,000255,872255,0008720.390625
9256,000511,744511,0007440.195312
10512,0001,023,4881,023,0004880.097656
111,024,0002,046,9762,047,000-240.048828
122,048,0004,093,9524,095,000-1,0480.024414
134,096,0008,187,9048,191,000-3,0960.012207
148,192,00016,375,80816,383,000-7,1920.006104
1516,384,00032,751,61632,767,000-15,3840.003052
1632,768,00065,503,23265,535,000-31,7680.001526
1765,536,000131,006,464131,071,000-64,5360.000763
18131,072,000262,012,928262,143,000-130,0720.000381
19262,144,000524,025,856524,287,000-261,1440.000191
20524,288,0001,048,051,7121,048,575,000-523,2880.000095

Which means that after the 10th bet you are still going to lose meat , even if you win the game. Mind you, it's about a 1 in 2000 chance. --Phelyan 08:19, 3 August 2006 (CDT)

• Figures. The first time I try that system, I end up losing twelve times in a row. Makes me wonder if this game is rigged in some way to detect the players who use such system, and make them lose... Eh, probably not - but 1 in 4096 chance still seems rather unlikely. -_- --Andemon 08:56, 6 October 2006 (CDT)

I'm getting a new "bet already taken" message.
"You can't take that bet", says the old man. "It's not here anymore. Someone probably got to it before you did."
--NoHassles 18:16, 3 December 2006 (CST)

When wearing the Tiki necklace, I lost more than I won. I constantly found myself losing more than 5 in a row. As soon as I took it off, I started winning again. Seems it brings bad luck to more than just surfing. --Molotovnight 10:43, 6 July 2007 (CDT)

It should be noted that each bet you make is independent from all the other bets you've made. In other words, you have the same chance of winning the 1,000 meat bet (50/50) as you do the 524,888,000 meat bet. Just note that if you're thinking of using this strategy. And Moltovnight, it was probably just a coincidence. --Venturboy 19:28, 31 July 2007 (CDT)

the only people who know this stuff are jick and the gang. For all we know every 241st bet in the month of febtober will win.--Qbr12 19:14, 19 February 2008 (CST)

## Minor Glitch

In the papaya shoot scenario, if your character is male, and the opponent's female, the text switches back and forth between he and she in the outcome text for the bet taker. It doesn't affect the actual game outcome, just the text result. Anyone else seen this? --Irregular 12:34, 8 May 2008 (CDT)

## Strategy

I noticed in the strategy page that it noted that you cannot break even or get ahead on the MMG. This is a lie, and I have the betting records to prove it:

Even after a ten loss streak (photo can be found [here] ), I still managed to make a [nice haul].

So, anybody that says the MMG is just to take your money, or that you cant get ahead, check out those links. --I Can Has Cheezeburger? 17:30, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

Some people have to win for other people to lose. That doesn't mean you (or anyone else) will stay ahead of the game if you continue playing. And when the page says "you cannot break even or get ahead" it means "if you continue playing." --Club (#66669) (Talk) 18:17, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

## Rare "Bet already taken" message

I got this message a few minutes ago when trying to take someone else's bet (if that wasn't obvious).

"You can't take that bet", says the old man. "It's not here anymore. Someone probably got to it before you did."

Is this a feedback message for some kind of database glitch? Seems like it's pretty rare, though based on a message a few lines up on this page, it is by no means new. --Luke 19:14, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

## Why there are table limits

The page states that table limits are in place (in casinos) to short-circuit the Martingale Strategy. This is a fairly common misconception, but is just not true. Table limits are in place, not to stop you from effectively using some system, but because casinos don't gamble. They don't want their profits going on a single bet, and they don't want to see their profits go down the drain to a single high-roller on a lucky streak. Martingale folks take only minor wins with a huge risk of losing all at once. An example of why table limits exist can be taken from the Golden Nugget in 2004, where they started catering to high-rollers, and had their entire years profit wiped by a single lucky player over the course of a couple of weeks, who won to the tune of \$8.5 million. Casinos are at no risk from Martingale players. They lose in the end like everyone else. I'd guess, in fact, that they probably lose a lot more than people who watch their money dry up one piece at a time. --Rgon 17:14, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

• while you're right, a house limit is one of the measures that can be used to make the martingale even less useful. --Evilkolbot 21:57, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

## Gender change

I can confirm that the gender of the papaya does change. 1212thedoctor 00:34, 9 November 2012 (CET)