Talk:The Sewer

If you try to take more than more or less items than 3 in the ten-leaf clover adventure, you get the message:

"Three shall be the number of items you take, and the number of items you take shall be three. Four items shalt thou not take, neither shalt thou take two, excepting that thou then proceedst to three."

This should probably be added to the article (unless it's somewhere else), right? It also looks like it's referencing Monty Python and the Holy Grail. -Fwahobadagadz 18:25, 24 April 2006 (CDT)

• It's already here. --Gymnosophist 19:42, 24 April 2006 (CDT)

In 87 trips to the sewer I got 40 trinkets (which seems about right) and 1 spices (which seems low). Anyone have a larger sample? --DirkDiggler 06:01, 10 May 2006 (CDT)

Another sample: 58 trips yielded 27 trinkets+gewgaws+knickknacks and 3 spices. I'm going to go ahead and assert a 50% trinket rate.--DirkDiggler 14:40, 16 May 2006 (CDT)

Data from July 2006 (no-sign DB with Nimble Fingers and Mad Looting and no other buffs or items):

Trips	disco ball	disco mask	helmet turtle	mariachi pants	pasta spoon	ravioli hat	saucepan	scroll of turtle	seal tooth	seal-clubbing club	spices	stolen accordion	worthless gewgaw	worthless knick-knack	worthless trinket	(total worthless)
1081	57	47	60	53	45	57	54	51	62	45	48	42	155	152	153	460
	5.3%	4.3%	5.6%	4.9%	4.2%	5.3%	5.0%	4.7%	5.7%	4.2%	4.4%	3.9%	14.3%	14.1%	14.2%	42.6%

--DirkDiggler 04:30, 28 June 2006 (CDT)

I had the same idea Dirk. I'm starting testing with 600 rounds as a HC muscle-sign TT, with no HP skills and only sympathy. It will take me a few days. We can pool data and see if we find anything. --Feng shweez 17:34, 27 June 2006 (CDT)

Data from July 2006 (Vole sign HC TT with Amphibian Sympathy and no other buffs or items):

Trips	disco ball	disco mask	helmet turtle	mariachi pants	pasta spoon	ravioli hat	saucepan	scroll of turtle	seal tooth	seal-clubbing club	spices	stolen accordion	worthless gewgaw	worthless knick-knack	worthless trinket	(total worthless)
600	29	28	28	38	23	31	21	28	29	15	24	26	101	97	82	280
	4.8%	4.7%	4.7%	6.3%	3.8%	5.2%	3.5%	4.7%	4.8%	2.5%	4.0%	4.3%	16.8%	16.2%	13.7%	46.7%

--Feng shweez 10:34, 5 July 2006 (CDT)

Cool. Let's pool the data -- just paste your data into a copy of the table above. I'm planning to get 1000 adventures worth. --DirkDiggler 04:30, 28 June 2006 (CDT)

I'm going to pool our data on the front page now. --Feng shweez 09:57, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

<2c> would jick have fine-tuned drop rates to two decimal places? is the game so finely balanced that one more disco mask per ten thousand adventures would cause havoc? no, and no. since there are 15 items, and three of the items appear to be three times more likely to appear than the others, my guess is that the percentages are: worthless item 3/21 or 14.29%, non-worthless 1/21 or 4.76%. which is not contradicted by the evidence. </2c> --Evilkolbot 12:16, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

You're probably right about the actual drop rates, but we're reporting measured values. This page shows the raw data with two significant figures (as befits the nominal sqrt(N)/N uncertainty of about 3%). The front page summarizes the information to one significant digit. This follows Yiab's precedent (as laid out in the Statistics Notes) of reporting measured and not implied drop rates. --DirkDiggler 15:02, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

• fair point. isn't there a place for implied drop rates, too, though? do we have to wait for 21k tests (yiab's suggested margin of certainty) to report what the evidence strongly indicates? i failed stats, you know. --Evilkolbot 15:09, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

• Um, isn't this data supposed to be here instead of here?--Dehstil (t|c) 15:19, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

• OK, added the data over there.--DirkDiggler 21:05, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

I think we should revive this place. Maybe there might have been some change in the coding since the summer of 06. In any case, I went for 200 turns in the sewer, do with it what you will.

Data from February 2007 (no sign normal SC with Seal Clubbing Frenzy):

Trips	disco ball	disco mask	helmet turtle	mariachi pants	pasta spoon	ravioli hat	saucepan	scroll of turtle	seal tooth	seal-clubbing club	spices	stolen accordion	worthless gewgaw	worthless knick-knack	worthless trinket	(total worthless)
200	8	8	6	10	9	9	10	20	5	5	10	12	24	32	31	87
	4%	4%	3%	5%	4.5%	4.5%	5%	10%	2.5%	2.5%	5%	6%	12%	16%	15.5%	43.5%

--Applejordan 23:12, 9 February 2007 (CST)

I just got an item called a turtle totem on my alt here. I've never heard of it before and it's not on the wiki. What is this? Something new?--JimmyHendrix 14:38, 7 May 2007 (CDT)

• Nevermind, I guess they changed scrolls to totems.--JimmyHendrix 14:55, 7 May 2007 (CDT)

Notes

"There are thirteen different items that can be obtained in The Sewer Luck adventure (the twelve starting items and one worthless item); a number usually avoided in KoL. Ironically,the name of the adventure is "Sewer Luck"."

Should this even be here? It's not even true; there's fifteen possible items to pull out of the sewer. It seems like a very trivial reference stretched tenuously. --Drab Emordnilap 12:20, 18 April 2008 (CDT)

It means that there are 13 Items in the clover adventure. --Qwertyu63 23:53, 22 June 2008 (CDT)

Back to drop rate spading

I've been collecting data on how much each item drops, and due to an oversight, only the total worthless drop rate is available. (Table copied from above)

Trips	disco ball	disco mask	helmet turtle	mariachi pants	pasta spoon	ravioli hat	saucepan	seal-clubbing club	seal-skull helmet	spices	stolen accordion	turtle totem	(total worthless)
1600	78	71	70	63	68	94	60	85	72	83	89	83	684
	4.9%	4.4%	4.4%	3.9%	4.2%	5.9%	3.8%	5.3%	4.5%	5.2%	5.6%	5.2%	42.8%

I'll be spending a few more hundred adventures in the sewer, so if I post updated data take note that it's not independent from this set. - Yug sdrawkcab eht 19:20, 5 December 2008 (UTC)